tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9684236.post110954499919817952..comments2023-10-16T06:10:24.969-04:00Comments on Julie Unplugged: The View from BelowAnonymoushttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00088119765077193302noreply@blogger.comBlogger9125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9684236.post-10416165394493908932007-05-12T00:15:00.000-04:002007-05-12T00:15:00.000-04:00Hello I want to congratulate to you. This site is ...Hello I want to congratulate to you. This site is fantastic, looks like entertained and very good to me it elaborated. 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Visit us for more info at: <A HREF="http://www.costa-ricarealestate.com/" REL="nofollow">http://www.costa-ricarealestate.com/</A>Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9684236.post-39304115657368341552007-04-14T20:25:00.000-04:002007-04-14T20:25:00.000-04:00Wanted to add...I am trying to say I believe both ...Wanted to add...<BR/><BR/>I am trying to say I believe both should happen. The look at eternity <I>and</I> self-scarificial service to others (along with honest assessment of our own complicity with evil).carriehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00483414028348315498noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9684236.post-60326200579280170052007-04-14T20:22:00.000-04:002007-04-14T20:22:00.000-04:00Is it possible that by focusing on the eternal con...<I>Is it possible that by focusing on the eternal condition of souls, we give people a way to ignore the troubling conditions of life as it is lived, here, on earth if you don't happen to be in the privileged set?</I><BR/><BR/>Yes, it is very possible that happens. But the fact that it happens doesn't mean the focus on eternal souls is wrong, only wrongly used by some.<BR/><BR/>Just because an idea (or even a real object) can be misused, doesn't mean it is bad or wrong in and of itself.carriehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00483414028348315498noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9684236.post-45136255612683614822007-04-14T20:17:00.000-04:002007-04-14T20:17:00.000-04:00That's why he can say that those who owned slaves ...<I>That's why he can say that those who owned slaves could not possibly be Christians.<BR/></I><BR/><BR/>I don't think Cone can single out this as a litmus test for Christianity. Or is the label Christianity even meaningful? I get a little confused, because first we are talking about how to make a religionless Christianity, one which doesn't draw lines for who is "in" and who isn't. Now we are back to making certain beliefs or behaviors mandatory (or forbidden) in order to call yourself a Christian.<BR/><BR/>Once you start drawing these lines, then you are back to a religion with a creed and rules to follow. Then people with different areas of passion (the poor, the orphans, victims of abortion, abuse, etc.) will start drawing their lines, too. If you have an abortion, you can't be a Christian, if you don't give everything to the poor and follow Jesus, you're not a Christian...and so on.<BR/><BR/>The more I study the more I think there is no one sin that will keep us away from God.carriehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00483414028348315498noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9684236.post-1109953413330583872005-03-04T11:23:00.000-05:002005-03-04T11:23:00.000-05:00I think that Christianity definitely has been misc...I think that Christianity definitely has been misconstrued in order to perpetuate racism. During slavery days, the Bible was frequently used to support the institution. I also agree that the Church has focused more on winning souls than on feeding mouths. I think the Bible has a hand in that, and just Christian doctrine in general. If you truly believe someone will burn in hell for all eternity, that will be more important for you to address than anything else. So does the problem lie with the church, or with Christianity?sojournesshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02827493348095938679noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9684236.post-1109686491615592972005-03-01T09:14:00.000-05:002005-03-01T09:14:00.000-05:00I like how you put this. I do think it is a commun...I like how you put this. I do think it is a community project. I was talking last nght with my friend who is the one who originally introduced me to these concepts. She's Catholic and runs the outreach arm of the local parish at the Univeristy. She said that the biggest step most of us have to make is to be <B>intentional</B>. White suburbanites aren't going to stumble across service projects. We have to seek out ways to participate.<br /><br />Additionally, we do best to join the projects that the communities deem important (not bring our ideas of what should be done to them). It's this "decentering of privilege" that is new to me. It really means we are not in control of how we serve, give or not. All we can do is particpate when we find out what that can mean in our communities.<br /><br />I like the Catholics around here because that seems to be the group that I have seen most engaged with our cities issues. But I am sure there are others too. I tend to be a bit saturated in the Catholic <I>thang</I> right now. :)<br /><br />Btw, I just noticed you've been updating your blog! I will get to it today. :)Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00088119765077193302noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9684236.post-1109673751875926382005-03-01T05:42:00.000-05:002005-03-01T05:42:00.000-05:00>>>The fact that Catholics see themselves as havin...>>>The fact that Catholics see themselves as having to contribute to the well-being of the poor as part of their Christian commitment and that those acts of charity have bearing on their eternal destination is very different than what I understood in my pre-Vineyard Christianity.<<<<br /><br />Yeah, it's kinda hard to get around that sheep vs. goat thing.<br /><br />>>>I am now wondering about the role of faith in the system itself. I'm trying to wrap my mind around what "systemic injustice" is and means and if it is just beyond my responsibility or not.<<<<br /><br />Don't you think it is an issue of individual vs. community? The system can only change in response to the community of individuals. So while I don't see myself responsible for changing the system, bearing my individual responsibility for doing justice will, in concert with others in my community assuming THEIR responsibility, bring about systemic change.my15minuteshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17120108669030817877noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9684236.post-1109553805128619492005-02-27T20:23:00.000-05:002005-02-27T20:23:00.000-05:00>>However, having read absolutely nothing of Cone ...>>However, having read absolutely nothing of Cone so far, I wonder if he might be overstating it a little.<<<<br /><br />That is certainly possible. I also think I may be intentional. Or he may just believe his viewpoint that passionately. Whatever the case, his thinking has certainly provoked much deeper reflection on my part than had he simply made room for an alternative point of view.<br /><br />>>>From what I've seen and heard in the RCC, there is an emphasis on identification with the suffering that I never had in my protestant experience. I don't know...just going on my personal experience, which is limited.<<<<br /><br />Yes, I can see that and agree with it. The fact that Catholics see themselves as having to contribute to the well-being of the poor as part of their Christian commitment and that those acts of charity have bearing on their eternal destination is very different than what I understood in my pre-Vineyard Christianity. <br /><br />The Vineyard had an emphasis on the poor that i hadn't experienced before that. It was a start. But it didn't really infuse the whole church. There were people who "worked in benevolence" and the rest gave money. We worked in benevolence for several years which meant bagging and distributing groceries to Hispanics.<br /><br />All of that is a start. I am now wondering about the role of faith in the system itself. I'm trying to wrap my mind around what "systemic injustice" is and means and if it is just beyond my responsibility or not.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00088119765077193302noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9684236.post-1109552892043593692005-02-27T20:08:00.000-05:002005-02-27T20:08:00.000-05:00>>>> Is it possible that by focusing on the eterna...>>>> Is it possible that by focusing on the eternal condition of souls, we give people a way to ignore the troubling conditions of life as it is lived, here, on earth if you don't happen to be in the privileged set?<<<<br /><br />I think you're right here. I have never felt much 'urge' to alleviate troubling social conditions, even though I'm sure I'm as well equipped as anyone to do so. It isn't part of spirituality in my upbringing. If it going to be part of it in the future, it will have to be a learned thing. Thankfully -- now that I am celebrating the liturgical calendar-- Lent rolls around and I am taught that I should spend time in prayer, fasting, and works of mercy. The prayer is old hat. The fasting is newer, but still at least part of the ideal of my past experience of spirituality. But the works of mercy part is new.<br /><br />>>>Have the twisted "Christian" values that enabled western Christians to practice centuries of racism (against blacks and Jews and Muslims) left us a legacy of faith that is detached from suffering because it has been in the habit of dominance?<<<<br /><br />I do think that the achievement of political power of the Church (in Rome, in America, in England) is a double-edged sword. I see that it has effected positive moral change. And yet, perhaps it has detached the Church from her humble roots. However, having read absolutely nothing of Cone so far, I wonder if he might be overstating it a little. From what I've seen and heard in the RCC, there is an emphasis on identification with the suffering that I never had in my protestant experience. I don't know...just going on my personal experience, which is limited.my15minuteshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17120108669030817877noreply@blogger.com